Talk:FC Barcelona

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1

[edit] El clasico

el clasico section is pretty poor, it could be improved. In my opinion it shouldn't focus as much on its history, but on the actual rivalry. It could also mentioned that it is watched all over the world by millions of peole. What do you think (I would sign if I knew how to) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 155.54.219.156 (talk) 22:55, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] External Links

I have noticed over the past few months that the External Links section appears to be the battleground of some sort of war between English speaking fansites. I have noticed on many occassions that one website has its link up and another website comes and deletes that link and puts its own up instead. I have fixed it for the short term. But I would like to either one of two things in the long term 1. The owners of these sites keep it civil, there is no reason i know of why both cant have their links up there, and one )because this war was fairly one sided) deleting the others link repeatedly does not portray your site in a good light or 2. We remove fansite links altogether and just link like in the Real Madrid page to only official pages. Let me know what you think.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.112.155.60 (talk) 21:51, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Jersey Colors

The Jersey colors for the team are incorrect, they obviously where red and blue home jerseys not blue and white. And their away kit is orange not those ugly colors you have put up.

away kit is blue for 07/08 season. 70.131.80.58 22:18, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Current Squad

I added the top comentary because someone erase from the squad Motta, Ezquerro and Maxi. They are players of the team until their departure is confirmed by the club.

Bojan had the #35 in the 2006-07. As it is not confirmed his presence in the first team, that number will be shown. Do not change it to 24 because you saw the Dundee match: it's a friendly !! Crosas wore Márquez's number and Valiente, Puyol's.

Rubén will no longer be the third keeper of the team. Oier Olazábal was the third goalie against Dundee United, and wore #28, although he didn't play. I just remove Rubén and placed Oier (I'm lazy, hehe).

Please discuss the numbers' change here before removing data with no source and probably wrongly. Let's talk before making mistakes ;)

--Buzz-chan 06:55, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

I have deleted #13 Jose Pinto Because it is a Rugby player, not a footballer —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.232.23.14 (talk) 21:40, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] World Cup Winners

The piece of trivia entitled "World Cup Winners" is a dreadful entry. Ronaldo, Ronaldinho and Gianluca Zambrotta did not win the World Cup as Barcelona players. If the trivia was meant to be "Players who've won the World Cup and played for Barcelona at any stage during their career, it still remains a dreadful piece of trivia. What about Diego Maradona, or Emmanuel Petit? Dreadful, truly dreadful.

[edit] Favourite Team

I added Barça's favourite team, chosen by the fans, but someone removed it. Why ?

[edit] Dates & dashes

En dashes should be used in scorelines and full dates should be wikilinked, including in the footnotes. See Wikipedia:Manual of Style (dashes) and Wikipedia:Manual of Style (dates and numbers). Epbr123 20:43, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Home kit socks.

It sort of bothers me that next season's socks will be striped (blue and red) and it shows in the page only blue. Can someone fix it?

Also, it's strange that I noticed that 2006\07 season's home kit hasn't been updated for a long long time (the stripes remained though the kit was half blue half red!) and this season it has been updated rather quickly, only this week the new kit was announced.

I might've dreamt, I'm pretty sure that I saw stripes in the kit image this season and only recently\last month it's been updated to the "halves".

YemeniteCamel 18:18, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Abidal kit number

Abidal is due to sign+medical exems at noon he dont have a number yet who may i ask decided hes gonna be 12?

Answer: Abidal will be #22, but if Motta leaves the team, he may change it to #3. It's just my idea, not the reality.

Buzz-chan 06:58, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Maxi Lopez

Maxi Lopez don't return to FCB,his contrat finished. He is'nt no 12.

Answer: He has still concract with FC Barcelona. He wore number 7 against Dundee Utd., but he has no number yet, because team's idea is to sent him on loan wherever.

Buzz-chan 06:58, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Edmilson not out

why u added edmilson leaving he is not leaving please confirm it!

Edmilson is injured for 4-6 months atm i dont think hes gonna get transferd in this situation

Well, he is going to Newcastle apparently, but he should still be kept in the squad until something actually happens. Mattythewhite 17:21, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

th home shirt is what it was last year but I think thers more stripes. Am I right

[edit] New Kit?

i noticed that the 07/08 kit no longer has the UNICEF logo on it. this isn't the official shop though, so i might be wrong. http://www.soccer.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Section_Id=1&Product_Id=290616

• The deal is for five years, ending in 2012. Here the new kits.--ClaudioMB 01:43, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Former Players

I notice in this section , some names are too long for article. So, i made some changes on them but someone made (undo) for that, with this comment Many were odd names, nobody in Barcelona knows them like that, Jose Bakero, Julio Moreno, C. Rodriguez, Miquel Nadal, Miguel Bernardo?? who are they??). But my changed did not make any miss in it,For Example (Juan Román Riquelme) to Riquelme This name whnt to be short :

Paulino Alcántara

Francisco José Carrasco

Francisco Fdez. "Gallego"

Miguel Bernardo "Migueli"

Giovanni van Bronckhorst

Alejandro Morera Soto

Julio César Benítez

José Ramón Alexanko

Ramon Maria Calderé

Enrique Castro "Quini"

Juan Román Riquelme

Juan Zambudio Velasco

Miquel Àngel Nadal --> to Miquel Nadal so if he click on name , he will find about Nadal's biography .

Also, the article needs to be good in ordering. Saudi9999 14:36, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

wouldnt it be easier to sort them by countrys? Innuendo1899 23 July 2007

Yes, it's sort by nation's flag, But I mean some names are too long which take two lines Like: ((Miguel Bernardo "Migueli"))Saudi9999 16:12, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

i know it does but look like in the Lyon article its not messy its sorted by,France,Brazil..etc Innuendo1899 23 July 2007

I was the one who changed their names, mainly because as I said, in Barcelona if you say "Jose Bakero, Julio Moreno, C. Rodriguez, Miquel Nadal, Miguel Bernardo" nobody knows who you are talking about.
Jose Bakero is always called Jose Mari Bakero (name: Jose Mari, surname: Bakero, football alias: Bakero)
Julio Moreno is always called Julio Alberto (name: Julio Alberto, surname: Moreno, football alias: Julio Alberto)
C. Rodríguez is always called César
Miquel Nadal is always called Miquel Àngel Nadal (name: Miquel Àngel, surname: Nadal, football alias: Nadal)
Miguel Bernardo is always called Migueli (name: Miguel, surname: Bernardo, football alias: Migueli)

Many Spanish first names are double, it is not a middle name like in English speaking countries.
Xagasi 17:52, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Formation

This formation is totally wrong. Thuram is not left back, and has never played as a left back. Secondly Iniesta is not a defensive midfielder or central midfielder, he is rather left or right sided midfielder, or wing player. i do not know who prepared this formation, but whoever prepared do not know anything about football.

Maybe this is right: Most frequent start and Most frequent pitch formation--ClaudioMB 16:47, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] BARCA SQUADS - HUGE ERROR!!!

SOMEONE MADE THE BARCA SQUAD WITH REAL MADRID PLAYERS!!!!!!!!!

No need to shout, and maybe you should have been bold and changed it. Mattythewhite 11:03, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Foreigners 07/08 Section

I think it's necessary for this article, since the rest of the Spanish clubs have it. Even more so considering the fact that Barcelona hardly has any Spanish players in their first team.

[edit] Juliano Belletii

Remains a Barcelona player. He DOES NOT play for Chelsea. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Glorfindel1993 (talk • contribs) 11:03, August 23, 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Squad numbers

The squad numbers are changing randomly at this point because of the fact that it's preseason and the full squad lineup hasn't been decided. Instead of writing XXX for Bojan's number, shouldn't it be -- like it was? I'm going to be bold and change it back, along with deleting Giovani's squad number since he has yet to feature in a competitive match for the team. That should change this weekend, but for now he has no true squad number (reflected in the official FCB squad listing). So I'm going to delete that as well as deleting Marc Crosas entirely as he hasn't made any competitive starts and carries a youth number (26+ in Spain). He is not on the official squad listing, therefore he should not appear on this page either. Please comment here so we can have a discussion of this, especially if I missed something on the project football talk page about this. Thanks, Isaiah 03:15, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

I've been using the LFP website as reference to squad numbers. I'm no expert on Spanish football, so is that resource sufficient for them? Mattythewhite 08:05, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

I prefer to use the FCB squad listing as the LFP is not responsible for the individual squads, but rather compiling that information later. That said, the LFP reflects what has occurred on the field more accurately, at least in this case. That is, Toure's number was 24 on Sunday against Racing and 24 last night against Inter. Thus, I think putting his number as 24 is acceptable, especially considering the likelihood of Gio Dos Santos taking that number this weekend. "Likelihood" of course is pure speculation, so leaving his number empty is important for now (as he's worn several numbers during the preseason/exhibition matches, it could change again). To recap: Toure as #24, Gio and Bojan as numberless. Isaiah 15:52, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Forgot to mention the part about Crosas. Why is he being repeatedly added to the squad list? He has played in exhibition matches, but is not a member of the first team squad. As I mentioned in my above comment, he has not received his competitive debut with the club and sports a youth number. Thus he, like Jesus Olmo, should not be included in the first team squad. Bojan and Dos Santos can be included as it has been declared publicly that they will be on the first team roster. They appear on the first team squad listing, for example. Perhaps Crosas will get a chance to be on the first team squad now that Eto'o is out, but until it is declared, he cannot be considered a member and thus should only appear on the Barcelona B page (and he does appear there) until a later date. Does anyone object to deleting Marc Crosas? If so, please explain why as I'm open to this. Isaiah 15:59, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Flag of Valencia Autonomo community.png

Image:Flag of Valencia Autonomo community.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 05:33, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism

Is not possible to protect this article due to increasing vandalism??

Xagasi 17:45, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Current Squad bolding

Why is the current squad in bold? According to the WP:Football [Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Clubs|team template]] page, the names should not be in bold. First, it goes against the above linked template and second, it is both confusing and ugly. Take Ronaldinho, for instance, who is listed as Ronaldinho de Assis rather than simply as Ronaldinho, which is how he is known around the world. Deco too, is known simply as Deco (though he is sometimes known as Anderson Deco). Take the Manchester United squad list, for example, which has Anderson and Nani, neither of which are known by their full names either, thus they are listed without them. (This is merely an example; I am not suggesting the ManU page is therefore better, but merely that it is more consistent with the rest of the site) The bold further complicates issues because it suggests there is something intrinsically more interesting about that player than normal players rather than the desired effect of highlighting which name he is known by.

I will not change the squad list now because I think this should be open for debate and there is technically no wrong information being distributed at the moment. Are there any thoughts on this? Isaiah 02:47, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe it should not be bold and be consistent for all players. Or use complete full names, or names used on their jerseys or the names the players are mostly known for. For that kind of layout, the last one seems to suit better. So, it's the same as use the names used in their articles, and let discussion about their mostly known names to happen in their articles. --ClaudioMB 03:57, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

OK, if the bold is not recommended, but why some players have only their 1st name and others have both 1st name and 1st surname instead. It is nonsense. Why "Oleguer Presas" is "Oleguer Presas" and "Xavi Hernández" is just "Xavi", why "Bojan Krkic" is "Bojan Krkic" and "Sylvinho Mendes" is just "Sylvinho"???
Could anyone tell me why different players have different situations?? Both Oleguer and Xavi are from Barcelona, they are both called just by their 1st name, not their surname, and here you always only find Xavi's surname missing. Does the one who continually removes it know how names and surnames rule in Spain???
And the same should happen with Deco and Ronaldinho, they have a surname or a first name too.
Best regards.
Xagasi 03:44, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe because they are mostly know by that names. For example, Sylvinho is a nick name. He's full name is Sylvio Mendes Campos Junior. I cannot guaranty, but probably he is know as Sylvinho since youth player. To make things practical, I think teams articles should just copy the names from the players' articles. If anyone doesn't agree with that used name, he/she should try to change first there, where editors know better the reason for that.--ClaudioMB 00:01, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

The reality of the situation is that most players are known by common names which appear in their player pages. The examples of Sylvinho and Ronaldinho are very easy in that they are globally known by their nicknames and thus should be listed as such. Bringing up Oleguer, however, is an interesting question. I would personally assume he goes by Oleguer Presas simply because he is not all that well known, but ESPN Soccernet seems to call him simply Oleguer in match reports while listing him as Presas Oleguer in their squad lists. I'm not sure what to make of that. Xavi, on the other hand, is known, at least in my experience, more widely as Xavi than as Xavi Hernandez. It also appears on the back of his jersey. I could understand calling him Xavi Hernandez to distinguish him from any other Xavi who may be around (Xabi Alonso comes to mind, but he's with a "b" rather than with a "v" and despite the pronunciation being the same, it looks different on paper). Bojan may be an exception to that as he sports Bojan on the back of his shirt, but Barcelona's official page refers to him has Krkic and not as Bojan, see here, so it makes sense to call him Bojan Krkic.Isaiah 02:46, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

In Barcelona city, where I live and I am from, we know all players by their footballistic name, but also by their 1st name and 1st surname (in Spain we all have 2 surnames, father's one 1st, mother's one 2nd). I don't understand why here some only have their footballistic names while others don't, and have their complete name and surname, I don't know why but people from outside Spain always gets very confused about that. Here many football players chose their 1st name as their footballistic name instead of their surname (Oleguer Presas, Xavi Hernández or Raúl González), others they chose both (Xabi Alonso), or even an alias (Miguel Ángel Ferrer "Mista"), or a short version of their surname (José María Gutiérrez "Guti"). -- Xagasi (talk) 17:34, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Former Spanish players regions

Could you please stop removing that?? Stop removing vital information others spent time to add?? Here in Barcelona that is as important, or even more, as the countries foreigner players come from. Thanks. -- Xagasi (talk) 17:36, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Early Years

I just edited the "Early Years" section and thought I'd make mention of something I changed, in case others disagreed with the change. The original paragraph read, "Merchant Taylors' School in Crosby, Merseyside" and I changed it to "Merchant Taylors' School in Crosby, England". The reason behind this change is based upon my thought that Crosby's being in Merseyside is not as important a bit of information as which country it is in. The paragraph discusses Switzerland and someone unaware of where Merseyside was could mistake it as being part of Switzerland. While this is easily remedied by clicking on the internal link provided, the incorporation of this information doesn't make it any clearer to a reader such as myself (I'm American) who is not intimately familiar with English geography. I am more than happy to discuss this further, however, but it should be born in mind that this is an international site, with many English-speaking countries represented, not just England, so a broader concept of where things are makes more sense to me. Thanks, Isaiah (talk) 19:40, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] El Clásico

The [edit] to the Clásico section is questionable, in my opinion, but rather than revert it, I thought I'd bring it up here for discussion. The main edit consists of expanding the sentence

"However, during the Spanish Civil War itself, members of both clubs like Josep Sunyol and Rafael Sánchez Guerra suffered at the hands of Franco supporters."

to

"However, during the Spanish Civil War itself, members of both clubs like Josep Sunyol and Rafael Sánchez Guerra suffered at the hands of Franco supporters. That Franco's regime subsequently intervened to ensure success for Real Madrid is widely alleged and believed, although denied by many Real Madrid supporters."

This seems a bit harsh and POV (especially unsourced), but I thought I'd bring it up for discussion, in case the writer wanted to defend his/her statements before a reversion took place. The dispute between the two clubs and the political nature of that relationship can't really be denied, but the particulars are, I'm sure, quite hotly debated. Any sources, would be fantastic (either from the web or books; two books jump to mind: Morbo by Phil Ball and Barca, a people's passion by Jimmy Burns) for either side to support their thoughts. Thanks, Isaiah (talk) 13:33, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Hi there, as the editor who made the edit, here are my thoughts. In the past this has been a point of debate here, and so I deliberately did not state it as fact, and indeed stressed the denial of it. I don't think there is in fact any meaningful doubt about it, but to avoid controversy (clearly unsuccessfully...) I wrote that it is widely alleged and believed. Surely this is beyond question? You can deny that it happened if you like, but it cannot be denied that that is the prevalent view, and that that understanding and belief is relevant to interpreting the relationship between Real Madrid and FC Barcelona, and indeed between Real Madrid and almost all other teams.

Interested in hearing other views. --Bcnviajero (talk) 15:30, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

I too would be interested in other views, but here's my overarching thought on the whole thing...I don't believe that what has been written is wrong, per say, but is perhaps in the wrong place and should be sourced better (communally, not necessarily individually). El Clasico is merely the game between the two clubs and could be a subsection of a full section dedicated to the rivalry between the two clubs. There is an entire article dedicated to the game that could easily be expanded instead. Because it is an article about the club as a whole, I think that fewer details about the rivalry and the game itself are necessary than would otherwise be true. Those are merely my thoughts for the moment. Thanks, Isaiah (talk) 00:26, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Current Era

What happend to the current era (after 2003)? Why is it deleted? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.66.119.83 (talk) 14:46, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Story behind the logo

I'm curious about some things about the FCB logo, especially the red cross on white background. Anyone willing to expand the article on this subject? Thanks. bbx (talk) 21:29, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

The red cross on white background is St George's Cross, that is also a part of the shield of the City of Barcelona. The flag with red and yellow bars is the Catalonian flag. The bottom part of the shield are the colors of the team.Xvrbx (talk) 17:13, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Catalan trophies

I know there is another 'part' on wikipedia where you can see Barça's trophies. But why are the Catalan trophies left out in this page? Those are domestic trophies Barça won and I don't see why those should be 'hid' from this page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by CJordi (talk • contribs) 07:21, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The Catalan flag has always been on the club shield

In the section C. de F. Barcelona(1939-74) we can read the following text: After the Spanish Civil War, the Catalan language and flag were banned and football clubs were prohibited from using non-Spanish names. These measures led to the club having its name forcibly changed to Club de Fútbol Barcelona and the removal of the Catalan flag from the club shield. All these statements are largely true but, as far as I know, the Catalan flag was NEVER removed from the club shield. RedSkyRider (talk) 20:25, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Technical staff and Board of directors

Under personnel, I've added a section about board of directors. I've put the current (as of March 17th) board of directors, and moved president Joan Laporta from Technical staff to Board of directors. I've only put the directors that have a VP range (or equivalent), and I've not included the ordinary board members. I can add them all if you think it's appropriate. Xvrbx (talk) 15:02, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

I've used the same format (tabular) for both Technical staff and Board of Directors, to make them consistent. I've notice that the technical staff section was referring exclusively to the Football/Soccer technical staff, so I've clarified this in the section title. Xvrbx (talk) 13:36, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

I´ve just updated the list of members of the Board of Directors with the recent quitting of 8 directors. I´ll update the page as soon as the new members are officially appointed. I've also removed the photograph of Marc Ingla, since he's no longer the VP nor a member of the Executive Council. If you need sources to justify my changes see http://www.sport.es/default.asp?idpublicacio_PK=44&idioma=CAS&idnoticia_PK=525834&idseccio_PK=803 Xvrbx (talk) 19:11, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New Kits for 08/09

I'm under the impression that the new kits will be out next Tuesday, but someone changed it anyway. Where can I find a picture of this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.76.238.133 (talk) 05:14, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Bright maroon, not red

Sorry for my english. I am spanish and I do not talk very good english. Yesterday we can saw the new shirt, trouser and socks for the Barcelone 08/09. I can see that it has been updated in Wikipedia English version, but there is a little mistake. You use red FF0000, which is no completely correct because although sometimes under sunshine you can see the shirt red the correct colour is bright maroon C32148. Is there somebody who can change it?,please. I can ensure as a member of fc barcelone I am, that the colours of barcelone are blue and maroon, not blue and red. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.59.136.206 (talk) 18:42, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Presas move to Ajax

Oleguer Presas was reinstated in the Barcelona article. Didn't he move to AFC Ajax? -- Alexf⁴² 17:11, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New squad numbers

Please change Messi's squad number under current squad to #10. He has replaced Ronaldinho.

Sources? -- Alexf⁴² 18:39, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

There isn't one; it's biased nonsense. Beemer69 ^chitchat 21:16, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

No, he's quite right... the new numbers are (2) Martín Cáceres (3) Piqué (10) Messi (11) Bojan (15) Keita (18) Milito (20) Alves (21) Hleb (27) Pedro (28) Sergi Busquets (29) V. Sánchez (30) V. Vázquez (31) Jeffren... source FC Barcelona's website.

Interesting issue: I watched this past week's friendly FC Barcelona against MLS Red Bulls(6-2). Jeffren played 2nd half and made one goal, sporting shirt #17 (all other numbers were as stated above). -- Alexf⁴² 01:10, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Hey, there was a complete article about the shirt numbers. Too bad I can't access it now. Anyway, Messi is #10 and I'm 100% sure about that. Caceres is indeed #2. And I don't think that counting on the friendlies is ok, because in one game Messi wore #19 shirt (despite #10 will be his official shirt number). HaGamal 20:12, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Selected Former Players deletion

I noticed that the Selected former players section was deleted citing WP:PROVEIT and I was hoping to open up a discussion about this. I'm unsure of where on WP:FOOTBALL to look for a wider discussion of such a topic, so I figured here was the best place to discuss it. I don't read the selected former player section as being "unverifiable" material because each of the pages listed should mention that the player previously played for Barcelona (and should therefore serve as its own self-justifying reference), though I think a case could be made concerning who, exactly is considered notable enough to be listed. Is that the point of this deletion and the "prove it" extends to the "notability" of individual players rather than to the entire concept of the list?

For instance, Josep Samitier is a verifiable legend (he's listed as such in many books about the club), so his name is certainly worthy of any such list. Is the idea to have a reference for every name listed? Would Michael Jordan require a citation in a similar list on the Chicago Bulls page? Or Alfredo Di Stefano in the Real Madrid page?

Thanks, Isaiah (talk) 18:08, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

There is a discussion at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football#Notable_former_players_list Fasach Nua (talk) 19:07, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, Fasach Nau. I have read the discussion and it seems to point towards going ahead and creating a standard definition of who should be included in a "selected former players" list, but that each team should have its own. So, in order to do so, I'd like to suggest the following criteria for inclusion in a list for Barcelona (a player should meet any of the following criteria, not all):

1. 50 or more league appearances for the club
2. 50 or more appearances for respective national team
3. have won a World Cup or major international tournament as a starter
4. have become undeniably famous (eg David Beckham would qualify for Preston North End)
5. have contributed something particularly important to either the club or the game in general (eg winning the Zamora or Pichichi trophies, the Balon d'or, etc)

I think the above criteria would keep flash-in-the-pan or bit-part players from being included (I will use Giovani Dos Santos and Santiago Ezquerro as respective examples of that, though Dos Santos could, if he plays enough games for Mexico, warrant inclusion because of what he did after leaving. Ezquerro could be included in Athletic Bilbao's page because of his 222 appearances, but he made no distinct impression either in terms of goals scored or games played for FCB).

What does everyone else think of the criteria? Any suggestions on how to improve it? Any criticism of what it would leave open to interpretation or who it would include that shouldn't be included? Isaiah (talk) 15:26, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

• I suggest the following

1. 50 or more league appearances for the club
2. Awarded significant individual honours during his time with the club (eg winning the Zamora or Pichichi trophies, the Balon d'or, etc)
3. Club record holders
4. Member of European Cup winning team with Barca

I don't think international acheivements and former youth team players that go on to have success elsewhere should be included in teams of this importance as players that have 50+ caps, major individual honours, club records and European Cup winners medals should provide a pretty comprehensive list. EP 13:07, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

I'm personally willing to accept that change in the criteria. As no one else seems to be interested, I'll go ahead and start working on that list. Should it be a separate article or should it be as it is right now, as part of the article. Also, does anyone have a reference we can use to make it a more credible list? Isaiah (talk) 15:47, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Here's a problem we're going to run into, however: to be considered a member of the European Cup winning team, do you have to have had played in the final game? Take Richard Witschge, for instance. He was on the team during the 91-92 season, but didn't appear in the squad. The squad list is at the bottom of that link. Does Witschge, who appeared 40 times for the club, get to be a part of this list by being a squad member or is some playing time required? Isaiah (talk) 11:48, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Culers

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Culers (or Culés if you will) a nickname for the Barca supporters and not the club itself? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.243.150.152 (talk) 18:49, 14 October 2008 (UTC)